You know what’s really wrong with the m/m genre?
Almost every person linked here.
That’s what’s wrong. A bunch of GLBT and alleged GLBT ally writers and bloggers pandering to a straight audience, tossing the rights and feelings and struggles of GLBT people under a bus in their desperate and ugly battle to be Top Bitch.
They make me sick. They make me ashamed to write m/m. They make me agree that m/m is a fetishistic, homophobic and exploitative genre that does nothing to improve the lives of GLBT people, enhance GLBT literature, or support GLBT rights. I don’t want them ranting about the rights of straight authors, because they’re pretending to speak for me, and they really, really don’t. The only people they care about are themselves, and those who subscribe to their selfish views.
I thought about locking this, but fuck it. I despise the Pigs, the Erastes, the Rowans, and all their hangers-on, and they despise me. At this point, I will wear their loathing like a badge of honour. If I could, legally, I would unpublish everything I’ve ever written in this genre in protest at their despicable, self-interested bleatings. So I will just say that this genre is sick, it’s diseased, it’s dominated by soulless, manipulative powerseekers with less talent for writing than for self-promotion, who write about love, but do nothing but spread hate, fear and misinformation.
I know there are good people writing m/m – people who care about GLBT people and their rights, people who aren’t greedy bullies, people who want to use their fiction to promote a positive healthy image of GLBT people to support social change and acceptance. But they’re not the voices who dominate.
Look at the voices which do dominate, and weep. Because like the Glenn Becks and Limbaughs of the world, you better get used to hearing them over and over and over and over. No other views will get a look in.
That’s what’s wrong with the m/m genre.
Comments off on the blog because almost all the people whose opinions I give a fuck about, are on LJ and we can have our conversations in private there.
Comments enabled, but I will pound trolls into the ground. Troll safe territory is the locked LJ/Dreamwidth post mirror. Please, don’t even think about commenting if you’re a friend of the people mentioned in this post, or want to defend their bullshit. I WILL delete your comments, and ban your arse. I am not in the mood for them or it.
I don’t manage to understand the fuss. Sure, you are hetero wrinting m/m your shunned by traditional publishing and apparently by LGBT too. So what? Did you exepect wine and roses?
I am against any sort of discrimination. I think that if a book is good it is good, and that’s it. Just as if it’s bad it’s bad. To me it should be: does it falls into the GLBT category? Is it good? If yes it’s in. If not, byebye.
But, comme on, it’s an effort done for and by LGBT, what’s wrong to want to keep it within it? I find it quite logical. If they want to help GLBT what would they be doing helping someone that’s not in that category?
The way the rule is writen, as I understand it, is that if something from a non-LGBT appeared that was actually in line with their purpose, it would have a chance. But they probably don’t get many of those and they want to discourage receiving thousands of slash fiction that lands nowhere near.
To me, the problem looks like it’s that women writing yaoi/Boy’s Love (which is and always has been, hetero literature writen for and by hetero girls) believing they are pro GLBT rights. That would be like considering that all the porno with f/f is pro-Lesbian rights. That’s not it, they are writing something from and for heterosexual females. They are not about gay rights.
Reply to MinakoIf they have a problem of being tolerated, IMHO, they should go wave the female equality flag. If hetero men have had all their f/f fantasies catered and cared and accepted for years, and they are mising that same espect/tolerance. Then it’s about gender discrimination, not sexual orientation.
Blah I’m probably not making any sense, sorry, my english just goes so far. Feel free to delete if you dislike anything I said, althought I would like better if you actually told me why you think I’m horridly wrong. I’m not into GLBT rights, never have been, just like I’m not into feminist rights or any other sort of whatever rights. I believe in individuals and their rights to all be equal. To me discrimination by gender, race , sexuality, religion, etc… are the simptoms of the lack of respect towards other human beings and I’ve always worried about that and not about speciffic brands of discrimination. So chances are that I’m uninformed and offensive without meaning to. Other POVs are always welcome, it helps to eliminate oppinions based on ignorance.
i can support Minakos comment. Till this discussion I wasn’t aware that so much non-GLBT writers are entering the Lambda award. Naive as I am I really thought it’s an award only for them, silly me.
Reply to sommerThis M/M genre has nothing to do with homosexuality as such and the part it plays in the lives of them who are actually gay.
Till the time when gay/lesbian authors can be shortlisted in any award-thingy, gay/lesbian authors can play any role they want without being in the closet, politicians can say openly I’m gay without being harrassed and threatened, the GLBT comunity has the right to do their own thing without whining straights at there frontsteps.
They should’ve done this sooner. Perhaps if they did, that piece of shit book “The Man Who Would Be Queen” wouldn’t have been on the runway for a Lambda award a while back. Then again, cis LGB people (as a whole) aren’t that great on T issues (and writing them), either, so I’m not really looking forward to any who decide to ’spice up’ their writing themes. And yeah, the m/m genre (as much as I’ve read of it in fiction, which is quite a bit) does tend towards straight women writing for themselves. Some of the books have vivre and character, but the great majority, ime, fall flat and fall hard. Trans characters (with and w/out ‘alternative’ sexualities) are sorely lacking in m/m genre as well. Really, really irritating. Don’t get me started on disability, class, or race in fiction…
Reply to A.W.“And yeah, the m/m genre (as much as I’ve read of it in fiction, which is quite a bit) does tend towards straight women writing for themselves. Some of the books have vivre and character, but the great majority, ime, fall flat and fall hard.”
And by life and character, I mean realistically, with a bit of depth and dealing with issues. Most (but again, not all!) of the m/m fiction I’ve read (I should probably point out I’m a hardcore bibliophile, yet again) seems to follow a basic template. Not sure how to explain it, really. Don’t mean to disparage a class of writers, but if you’re not living something, it’s often rather harder to incorporate it in fiction. And if you are living about it and you do write about it, mainstream won’t publish you. On the other hand, if you’re not lgbt in life, there’s a much greater chance that some other publishing company is going to call your lit as “A breakthrough in speculative fiction” and “A novel, edgy bit of work that gives a twist to yadayadayada plotline”. I’ve read a hell of a lot of drivel in every genre imaginable, though, so I’m also a cynical bastard. – shrugs -. I’m also picky, so that’s part of it.
Kinda reminds me of Margaret Seltzer and such, actually, only without the ‘true creds’ touting the tragic, angsty-story-of-survival bit.
But I mean, anyway, that if Lambda is getting this huge influx of straight women writers for m/m (and I don’t doubt that they are, they dominate the author’s lists I’ve poked through) then yeah, that is a bit of a problem for an organization who’s goal is to promote lgbt authors, life issues and fiction through literary award. In the beginning, no one wanted to write about lgbt issues, so I doubt they needed a disclaimer. If straight women are so pissed off then they can create an award that’s just judged on the written content of the book. I’m not sure how well it would go, though, I’ve this sneaking suspicion the majority of the writers will (usually indavertantly, because that’s how privilege works) ‘pull a fast one’, like the mainstream fiction authors do to women authors in fiction. Science fiction in particular. “No, we’re not excluding you, your writing just ….isn’t what we’re looking for in a novel.” or “The characters/plot/theme won’t appeal to the ‘public’.”
I must admit, I read some of the blog posts in the list you linked to. The comments about ‘what about the sex changes’ doesn’t engender my sympathy. I’m not a damn sex change, those particular authors can keep their phobic award-winners to themselves.
Reply to A.W.“Kinda reminds me of Margaret Seltzer and such, actually, only without the ‘true creds’ touting the tragic, angsty-story-of-survival bit.”
(sorry, I’m an absolutely horrible multuple poster)
….and you know, the other thing about the true creds bit and writing about minority life/issues? To people who’ve experienced crap like that, the stories themselves tend to ring – false -. There’s generally some good bits, but it’s like a bell goes off when something is (to me) blatantly not-right. And I don’t think a lot of people who aren’t in the demographic realize that, honestly, and I also think it happens in a lot of different genres.
Reply to A.W.I mean, I have found some gems in m/m fiction (try to stay away from romance lit, honestly, because for every gem there’s 25-30 pieces of, well, generic crap, and I’ll never get back the weeks I spent / spend (like prodding a sore tooth) trying to find a decent novel) and I just get …tired of wading through, really.
Reply to A.W.Thanks for all your comments. As an m/m author, I wish I could convince you that you’re wrong…but I can’t. It’s not a gay friendly genre, when you get down to it. That makes me very sad, and very angry as well. Wish you well in your search for the real deal.
Reply to Ann SomervilleI’m fastly discovering that I agree with that. I didn’t know until a short while ago that m/m was getting published. I was ecstatic when I realized it. Finally people I used to read online could get some credit and cash for their efforts. And I thought it was going to be great for me, as a m/m reader, to finally be able to stop passing most of my time searching for a good read instead of reading. Some time later I’m sad to see that being published doesn’t means its necessarily going to be better (not talking about self-publishing, that’s different).
Reply to MinakoSome authors (and publishers) managed to transform m/m into generic romance minus the woman.
At this point, I’m not even sure that a blind-to-the-author review of any work would, well work, for any publishing company. For interactions in literature, people like what’s familiar and they, very slowly, change their views as they get to know the intricacies of other people and groups. If they like what’s familiar, they generally also reward what’s familiar, and Lambda does the same. Not the first time I’ve disagreed with Lambda on book recs because they ended up being offensive. I’ve read a lot of comments saying something to the effect of “Well, if the panel was blind, that would solve the problem.” and you know, I don’t think it would. Pretty much every book has subtle -isms in it. Minorities in questions also include those tropes that directly affect ‘em in negative ways (because face it, they seep through the brain and simmer beneath the surface, constantly have to root them out). It’s just that, if you’re not part of the minority (or if you’re not part of the culture) there tends to be more of it shown in a work. Another problem is, you can have a book with a nice plotline and excellent writing skills, but it could be fetishistic, homophobic, classist, or racist as all hell, just lurking through there. Which is a bit of a ways away from your original post, (although quite a lot of those m/m books are fetishistic, they seem to just cross out the woman character in a het couple and insert different pronouns) but the frequency of popular tropes in literature is disheartening.
Reply to A.W.Heh, thanks. I’m a hoarder, though, and I – do – like finding gems. Makes the hunt worthwhile. To be fair, a lot of genres aren’t kind to the people they write of. On the other hand, I just read your excerpt of “Reaching Higher” – it’s even harder to find good sci-fi books with an lgbt theme, so m’buying it. It’s damned rare that I get sucked in on the first paragraph, let alone the first sentence, lemmie tell you. Last book that happened to was Mockingbird by Stewart for the paragraph, and I can’t even remember the last one where the first sentence caught my mind. So quite glad I stumbled on your blog, all together, and thank you muchly for writing.
Reply to A.W.You’re welcome, and I’m so thrilled you were inspired to read ‘Reaching Higher’. If you like it and want to read more, I’d be happy to send you the third part of Encounters for free. Just let me know.
Reply to Ann Somerville